A friend of mine has published a text on a [Source] blog under CC BY.
An extract of the text, (which is on history of England) has been reproduced by a [User] site which offers full access to a bank of texts/lectures to students (who have to support the site by a subscription of few dimes per day)
The site has refused to give full recognition (name and link to the [Source] blog) to the extract.
Started by Tru Dô-Khac on April 16. 2013
An extract of the text, (which is on history of England) has been reproduced by a [User] site which offers full access to a bank of texts/lectures to students (who have to support the site by a subscription of few dimes per day)
The site has refused to give full recognition (name and link to the [Source] blog) to the extract.
Started by Tru Dô-Khac on April 16. 2013
Number of comments as of April 21. 2013 : 19
(...)tdk
Billy,
thank you for your response and the link.
The person [User Site contact point] has been contacted.
1. he [has agreed] to place the reference on the full text that you can access after entering into the private place (eg after paying a suscriber fee)
but
2. he [does not want to bother] to make the reference visible for the extract that you can see without having to enter the private place.
Why so ?
thank you for your response and the link.
The person [User Site contact point] has been contacted.
1. he [has agreed] to place the reference on the full text that you can access after entering into the private place (eg after paying a suscriber fee)
but
2. he [does not want to bother] to make the reference visible for the extract that you can see without having to enter the private place.
Why so ?
(...)tdk
[to confirm "1." supra] There is an explicit response saying that the full reference has been set with the full text.
A second request was sent to have the reference set with the extract as well.
No response yet.
(...)tdk
@Billy,
Thank you for your suggestion to seek advise for a IP/copyright lawyer.
However, the costs might place this advise out of reach.
The Source Site is owned by a private citizen who is passionate of what he is sharing.
He does not intend to do some business (and anyway, what value would you ask ?), he just wants his name and site name and backlink displayed on the User Site.
[Overmore] The effectiveness is questionnable.
The legal notice of the User Site does not say where it is registered.
There is just an address of a lawyer to receive claims from possible copyright infringements.
However, the costs might place this advise out of reach.
The Source Site is owned by a private citizen who is passionate of what he is sharing.
He does not intend to do some business (and anyway, what value would you ask ?), he just wants his name and site name and backlink displayed on the User Site.
[Overmore] The effectiveness is questionnable.
The legal notice of the User Site does not say where it is registered.
There is just an address of a lawyer to receive claims from possible copyright infringements.
(...)Billy
[suggesting to engage the CC Community]
(...)tdk
@Yasmine, Chitu,
Thank you for your insights.
if i understand well : [you say]
when you display on a site only an extract of a text under CC-BY, you do not need to display the author name and/or the source (the web name and address if the extract is reproduced from a source web) ?
if i understand well : [you say]
when you display on a site only an extract of a text under CC-BY, you do not need to display the author name and/or the source (the web name and address if the extract is reproduced from a source web) ?
(...)tdk
Chitu,
the "fair use" might be more or less the "exception aux droits d'auteur" of France (L122-5).
Under the "fair use", does it mean that you can reproduce a small,- but distinctive-, extract of a text without putting in quote or in italic, and without mentionning the reference of the author/source ?
Under the "fair use", does it mean that you can reproduce a small,- but distinctive-, extract of a text without putting in quote or in italic, and without mentionning the reference of the author/source ?
(...)tdk
Yes, "lawsuits and lawyers' $$$ are built on the differences" [between the various copyright legislation].
So the right way is to find a business agreement (which does not prevent to hire a lawyer).
Why do you think that this site producer refuses to cite the author/source with the text extract displayed on the web and agrees to cite with the full text accessible in the private space ?
Yes, "lawsuits and lawyers' $$$ are built on the differences" [between the various copyright legislation].
So the right way is to find a business agreement (which does not prevent to hire a lawyer).
Why do you think that this site producer refuses to cite the author/source with the text extract displayed on the web and agrees to cite with the full text accessible in the private space ?
(...)tdk
@Chitu
CC-CY is saying
(human-readable summary of the Legal Code).
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/
"You are free:
to Share — to copy, distribute and transmit the work
to Remix — to adapt the work
to make commercial use of the work
Under the following conditions:
Attribution — You must attribute the work in the manner specified by the author or licensor (but not in any way that suggests that they endorse you or your use of the work).
(...)
Definitely, the site owner should cite the author name and source with the text extract, don't you think so ?
Better late that never, and i would feel that the source owner would be fine.
As for the business model, i would feel that there are a lot of ways to add value on [top of ] a collection of texts.
(human-readable summary of the Legal Code).
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/
"You are free:
to Share — to copy, distribute and transmit the work
to Remix — to adapt the work
to make commercial use of the work
Under the following conditions:
Attribution — You must attribute the work in the manner specified by the author or licensor (but not in any way that suggests that they endorse you or your use of the work).
(...)
Definitely, the site owner should cite the author name and source with the text extract, don't you think so ?
Better late that never, and i would feel that the source owner would be fine.
As for the business model, i would feel that there are a lot of ways to add value on [top of ] a collection of texts.
(...)tdk
On the technical aspects :
"This might require reprogramming the site to add a citation field, and then entering that data on all existing sources".
Indeed, to innovate, you need to assess carefully the business context, the supply chain constraints,...
"With attribution, readers could skip the payment and then go look up the source themselves. "
There is no need for attribution [to find the source text]. Just use google with a couple of lines and the source text should pop up
(...)tdk
@Chitu,
"it is so important to him [the author] that he is willing to share it for free" (and that he doesn't care for attribution)
So why, to your opinion, has the author not placed the article into the public domain ?
(...)tdk
"If the site owner had not previously attributed the full text (...) then that would have been being a naughty boy"
To comply with CC-BY, would you suggest to apply the rule :
under CC-BY, you have to attribute if and only if you use the full text
or said differently,
under CC-BY, you do not need to attribute if you use only an extract of the text ?
(...)tdk
"Fair dealing or fair use laws normally make exceptions to copyright that permit certain restricted or limited uses of published work, regardless the will of the copyright owner"
"Normally", depending on regulation
As for France, L 122-5 says
"Lorsque l'oeuvre a été divulguée, l'auteur ne peut interdire :
Sous réserve que soient indiqués clairement le nom de l'auteur et la source :
Les analyses et courtes citations justifiées par le caractère critique, polémique, pédagogique, scientifique ou d'information de l'oeuvre à laquelle elles sont incorporées"
http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCodeArticle.do?cidTexte=LEGITEXT000006069414&idArticle=LEGIARTI000006278917&dateTexte=20081211
So under French regulation, you should give attribution when you use an extract of the text.
Please note that the above is my own opinion based on my own experience and it is up to anyone who reads us to consult a qualified lawyer.
(...)tdk
Now, from a business point of view, would you think that it would be fair enough to give attribution when you represent a distinctive extract of a text and in addition to show precisely what is borrowed ?
(...)tdk
Chitu,
thank you for sharing your thoughts.
Here are my quantum of thoughts.
For some people, fame might be a reason.
But i would believe that most of creators/inventors/authors/researchers/artists are simply expecting recognition.
As for the business motives, i would fully agree : attribution means knowledge, business trust, and professionnal services
* knowledge : any piece of thoughts has to be put in perspective to raise true knowledge. Attribution helps you to distinguish between a marketing pitch promoting private interests, an observation based on scientific research, an opinion founded on ideology...
* business trust : attribution helps to draw the line between information and disinformation
* professionnal/educational services : as you say, allow creators/inventors/researchers/artists to raise a family.
An "information governance" that all industrial sectors but culture/media/communication sectors, should take inspiration is the governance of the academical sphere to ensure ethical and intellectual integrity : i would feel that ethical and intellectual integrity increase innovative capabilities.
Let me point you at some pages (under CC-BY-SA) called "The business impact of IP"
These pages present a concept named "Institute 2.20". I created Institute 2.20 by reacting to Enterprise 2.0 coined by Pr. Andrew McAfee on his blog on May 27. 2006.
http://entreprise-numerique-creative.blogspot.fr/2011/09/business-impact-of-ip.html
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